@M27 which version of the myth? To the middle 1/3 of papa Abe’s bunch, sure, but to the newest, he was merely a prophet and the others barely allow ‘rabbi’.
I have read some historians think that a lot of the Jesus stories were created by Romans to use as political ammunition to control the pesky locals in the middle east. It has more truth to it than any christian apologist historian. No archeological evidence means that he most probably never existed as a single human. Apply Occams razor and yes, Jesus is a myth….
hmmm, it’s generally accepted that a preacher bloke called Yeshua from Nazareth lived in Palestine in the ’00s, was baptised and crucified. That he was purely mythical is essentially fringe theory.
Pliny the Younger on Christians – wikipedia article on the “pagan account to refer to Christianity”, AD 110. They were putting them to death, and he thought he’d check in with Trajan on it. Trajan thought that was OK, as long as they really were Christians – like, not just fingered by someone. You could curse Jesus and get off, or recite a prayer to Apollo or something. This was in a part of modern day Turkey, Black Sea coast. I doubt there was much Roman involvement in the theology.
You see, without the archeology to back it up I reckon it’s all bollocks. That yeshua geezer is as real as Sherlock Holmes or Harry Potter. And most of yhe Historians studying in that area have a dog in the Race so Confirmation bias rules…..he never existed until solid archeology can prove he did…end of…
I think it possible that there was an itinerant preacher named Jesus, who preached the Golden Rule, and told some good jokes like ‘render unto Caesar’ (with a debased coin!), and ‘mote and beam’ (authentic carpenter’s humor), and ‘may he who is without sin cast the first stone’ (biting satire): and after he was atrociously executed by the imperial oppressors, his followers kept the story alive, and added supernatural and pagan tropes. If after a century the accretions outweighed the facts, themselves compromised in the repeated retelling, and the fact to fantasy ratio in the tale was low but not zero, then did the ‘Jesus Christ’ person in the tale exist or not? Yes but no!
If you actually care, rather than ‘don’t even bother stirring: just kick the damn pot over’ per usual, you might try the Jesus Mythicism series at Tim O’Neill’s historyforatheists.com. I believe you’ll relate to his style 😉
Aye. All that subjective bollocks gleaned from all that horseshit written by all those ancient arseholes. If it can’t be tested by experimentation or proven with math it is probably made up nonsense…all ofbit, without exception….all history is effectively subjective nonsense and I’m not having it at all…so unkess sombody gives me Jesus’ mitochondrial D.N.A you can all fuck off…
Yeah, clearly something happened and the atoms in those sapiens all interacted in Hilbert Space…however the subjective nonsense written by ignorant (by 21 century standards) savages who most likely made it all up, or at least sexed it up or whatever .without Archeological science you can prove nothing and thus…what can be asserted without evidence can be rejected without evidence…end of
I think, personally, that it went like everything retold time after time. The story gets added to and slightly made a bit better at each iteration, so some guy named Jesus probably had sweaty feet and the story ended up with him walking on water.
From our “esteemed” congresswoman, Marjorie Taylor Greene, “God is sending America strong signs to tell us to repent. Earthquakes and eclipses and many more things to come. I pray that our country listens.”
Marjorie Taylor Green? Can’t she be crucified on Route 66? I’m sure she would love it and with Nail guns it wouldn’t take long to “Nail some sense into her”…
Otterbe. The Tim O’Neill site, also suffers from essentially from the same problem as the myths it is busting. All the historical texts of antiquity may ALL be fabricated. And timelines may be warped over 2000 years of “interpretation”. I would say that at best those documents are mere shadows on the walls of the cave. They are not mirrors are they?
Oh, c’mon, Holts. You are much better versed in statistics & probability math than I am: how many assumptions would need to be true if ALL of our extant texts from antiquity were fabricated? -Especially given the various texts we have from all over the Roman Empire: if a letter written by a Consul in the British isles in the 3rd century lines up with an epistle by a church father in the Sinai, methinks the gist is more likely to be true than some great ancient conspiracy.
I get it: you’re anti-intellectual, and love to flex your Manchester working-man’s cred, but, man, that kind of blather sullies even the very image you’re trying to project—not to mention seriously insulting actual historians who read this strip (and used to comment here). kin ya give ‘er a rest there, mate?
Please?
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August 3, 2011
They agree!
Anyway, thought that the myth of Jesus had him as demi-god or part of a triumvirate?
@M27 which version of the myth? To the middle 1/3 of papa Abe’s bunch, sure, but to the newest, he was merely a prophet and the others barely allow ‘rabbi’.
I have read some historians think that a lot of the Jesus stories were created by Romans to use as political ammunition to control the pesky locals in the middle east. It has more truth to it than any christian apologist historian. No archeological evidence means that he most probably never existed as a single human. Apply Occams razor and yes, Jesus is a myth….
hmmm, it’s generally accepted that a preacher bloke called Yeshua from Nazareth lived in Palestine in the ’00s, was baptised and crucified. That he was purely mythical is essentially fringe theory.
Pliny the Younger on Christians – wikipedia article on the “pagan account to refer to Christianity”, AD 110. They were putting them to death, and he thought he’d check in with Trajan on it. Trajan thought that was OK, as long as they really were Christians – like, not just fingered by someone. You could curse Jesus and get off, or recite a prayer to Apollo or something. This was in a part of modern day Turkey, Black Sea coast. I doubt there was much Roman involvement in the theology.
You see, without the archeology to back it up I reckon it’s all bollocks. That yeshua geezer is as real as Sherlock Holmes or Harry Potter. And most of yhe Historians studying in that area have a dog in the Race so Confirmation bias rules…..he never existed until solid archeology can prove he did…end of…
And just like Yeshua, there exist real people named Harry Potter in the world.
.
That doesn’t mean they attended Hogwarts.
I think it possible that there was an itinerant preacher named Jesus, who preached the Golden Rule, and told some good jokes like ‘render unto Caesar’ (with a debased coin!), and ‘mote and beam’ (authentic carpenter’s humor), and ‘may he who is without sin cast the first stone’ (biting satire): and after he was atrociously executed by the imperial oppressors, his followers kept the story alive, and added supernatural and pagan tropes. If after a century the accretions outweighed the facts, themselves compromised in the repeated retelling, and the fact to fantasy ratio in the tale was low but not zero, then did the ‘Jesus Christ’ person in the tale exist or not? Yes but no!
It is possible that we are in a computer simulation, but possible is a long way from probable isn’t it?
Holt,
If you actually care, rather than ‘don’t even bother stirring: just kick the damn pot over’ per usual, you might try the Jesus Mythicism series at Tim O’Neill’s historyforatheists.com. I believe you’ll relate to his style 😉
It’s generally accepted that Joseph Smith and L. Ron Hubbard also existed.
L. Ron was extant. As was Smith. But the difference in the archeological age betwixt them and Jesus is considerable…clearly
Aye. All that subjective bollocks gleaned from all that horseshit written by all those ancient arseholes. If it can’t be tested by experimentation or proven with math it is probably made up nonsense…all ofbit, without exception….all history is effectively subjective nonsense and I’m not having it at all…so unkess sombody gives me Jesus’ mitochondrial D.N.A you can all fuck off…
yeah, what m27holts says.
why, in this year, are we discussing/disputing something purported to be written as “the truth” almost 2k years ago?
Yeah, clearly something happened and the atoms in those sapiens all interacted in Hilbert Space…however the subjective nonsense written by ignorant (by 21 century standards) savages who most likely made it all up, or at least sexed it up or whatever .without Archeological science you can prove nothing and thus…what can be asserted without evidence can be rejected without evidence…end of
I think, personally, that it went like everything retold time after time. The story gets added to and slightly made a bit better at each iteration, so some guy named Jesus probably had sweaty feet and the story ended up with him walking on water.
From our “esteemed” congresswoman, Marjorie Taylor Greene, “God is sending America strong signs to tell us to repent. Earthquakes and eclipses and many more things to come. I pray that our country listens.”
Witnessing a full eclipse is on my bucket list…
Marjorie Taylor Green? Can’t she be crucified on Route 66? I’m sure she would love it and with Nail guns it wouldn’t take long to “Nail some sense into her”…
Otterbe. The Tim O’Neill site, also suffers from essentially from the same problem as the myths it is busting. All the historical texts of antiquity may ALL be fabricated. And timelines may be warped over 2000 years of “interpretation”. I would say that at best those documents are mere shadows on the walls of the cave. They are not mirrors are they?
Oh, c’mon, Holts. You are much better versed in statistics & probability math than I am: how many assumptions would need to be true if ALL of our extant texts from antiquity were fabricated? -Especially given the various texts we have from all over the Roman Empire: if a letter written by a Consul in the British isles in the 3rd century lines up with an epistle by a church father in the Sinai, methinks the gist is more likely to be true than some great ancient conspiracy.
I get it: you’re anti-intellectual, and love to flex your Manchester working-man’s cred, but, man, that kind of blather sullies even the very image you’re trying to project—not to mention seriously insulting actual historians who read this strip (and used to comment here). kin ya give ‘er a rest there, mate?
Please?