This is the first I’ve heard the term ‘Kafka trap’.
I guess the name is because of something in the fiction of Kafka, but I don’t know enough his writings to say what it would be.
Author, once again you contribute to my amazing store of trivia. I’d never heard of the Kafka trap, though I seem to recall it being used on me. Denial of the existence of god implies recognition of the concept of god, thus a belief that god exists. Philosophy 101 bollocks of course. Thanks again.
As was quoted “man went on to prove that god didn’t exist, ‘oh ghat was easy said man’, he went on to prove that black was white and then sadly got run over on the next zebra crossing he encountered….
That’s a good point. Not as stated – of course recognition of the concept of a flat earth does not equal belief that the earth is flat.
But indeed, it’s hard to deny the existence of god without accepting some concept thereof, likely the culturally dominant one – and if you don’t believe in it, there was no really good reason to accept that concept. So there’s a circularity there, albeit in a sort of negative way.
Mrs Kafka thought she’d seen the worst
That morning she and Mr Kafka burst
Through Franz’s door and saw the mattress dwarfed
By carapace, and her boy metamorphed –
The worst, at least, until her husband threw
The boy’s aquarium down, its contents too:
The sea invertebrates he’d been collecting.
“Why …” But Mr Kafka, interjecting,
Growled for every husband’s lost hegemonies:
“Verdammt! With Franz like this, who needs anemones?”
Well once My wife and I bumped into a past girlfriend of mine (before I met my wife). Afterwards she asked me if I’d slept with her. I truthfully said “no”. Interrogation over and wife happy. If only she had asked the question in a way tbat most men would have…
If you wonder, like me, how alas
Christians could give Trump a pass,
The best verse you’re liable
To find in the bible:
The dreaded jaw bone of an ass.
Trump seems to have disappeared off the map. Has he gone back to his reptilian lair in the hidden lands of the tsetse fly in equatorial africa to plot world domination with the rest of his fifth-column zionist shape changing reptilian brethren?
M27Holts: Re Trump: If only! In fact he still has a lot of residual support from republican supporters, with an eye to the 2024 presidential election. And he is having money-related legal problems, not least here in my native Bonnie Scotland re his two loss-making golf courses, which are suspected of being connected with money-laundering. We can only hope for a suitable cardiac event, which is not too unlikely.
Maybe his golf courses are secret entrances to tunnels that lead to a subterranean base under Loch Ness where the lizard aliens are secretely breeding an army of machine augmented mosasaurs that can be released to attack the uk’s submarine force…the sightings are of prototype cyborgs on their way to sea trials from their subterranean monster pens deep beneath scotland…
Breathes there the man, with soul so dead,
Who never to himself hath said,
This is my own, my native land!
Whose heart hath ne’er within him burn’d,
As home his footsteps he hath turn’d,
From wandering on a foreign strand!
If such there breathe, go, mark him well;
For him no Minstrel raptures swell;
High though his titles, proud his name,
Boundless his wealth as wish can claim;
Despite those titles, power, and pelf,
The wretch, concentred all in self,
Living, shall forfeit fair renown,
And, doubly dying, shall go down
To the vile dust, from whence he sprung,
Unwept, unhonour’d, and unsung.
Since there’s talk of Trump, and poetry, here’s a one I wrote in 2018:
Conman’s Sonnet
They still believe in the golden god,
who cheats at home,
who cheats abroad,
who will not call the righteous friends,
and flatters vicious enemies,
and pursues only greedy ends,
and will betray the very ones
that offer troth.
When the edifice of falseness falls,
who will the godling blame
to save his skin, to clear his name?
Here’s another query:
Is he malicious? or merely mercenary?
Both, I think. I think it’s both.
Jesus & Mo (the characters) are absurd, blinkered, and oddly very sweet. J&M (the cartoon) is brilliant: sharp, delicious, irresistible. Salman Rushdie
Jesus and Mo cartoons are wonderfully funny and true. Richard Dawkins
Jesus and Mo make the world a better place, bless their little hearts. Ophelia Benson
In a world defined by outrage and offence and liberal spinelessness, Jesus and Mo is a treasure, whose value we should never fail to recognize. Read them. Laugh. And think. Kenan Malik
The brilliant, celebrated, freaking hilarious atheist comic strip ... Greta Christina
...rays of sanity in a befuddled world. Keri Hulme
The liveliest depictions of Muhammad currently available... Malise Ruthven
J & Mo is the funniest and most consistently thought-provoking cartoon strip on the Net. In a saner world, it would run in a major newspaper. Nelson Jones, Heresy Corner
Consistently amusing, frequently thought-provoking and often heart-warming. New Humanist
Jesus & Mo is one of the most wonderful things on the internet.. JT Eberhard
Wittily captures much of the absurdity of religious apologetics. Mano Singham
I love jesusandmo.net cartoons - witty and sharp! Katha Pollitt
Often hilarious, frequently wry, these cartoons do what all the best cartoons do: they tell the truth through humour. Terry Sanderson, NSS President
...a wonderfully acid British cartoonist... Nick Cohen
I love the scrappy mockery of Jesus and Mo. Freedom of speech
includes the freedom to mock any person, any thing, any activity, and
any belief -- and J&M stands up for this unflinchingly Richard Stallman
...empowering, important and deeply progressive, not to mention hilarious... Council of Ex-Muslims
June 13, 2008
Heads I win, tails you lose!
SoG: No, I deny that !
The Devil eh? He definately needs a better PR person…
Mockingbird: OK, have it your own way:
Tails you lose, heads I win.
This is the first I’ve heard the term ‘Kafka trap’.
I guess the name is because of something in the fiction of Kafka, but I don’t know enough his writings to say what it would be.
A Google search found this:
https://lifelessons.co/critical-thinking/kafkatrapping/
The term “Kafkatrap” was coined by Eric S. Raymond, a man who thinks black people are naturally dumber than white people
SoG: OK One of us must be a tosser. 🙂
Surely the fallacy was used by the inquisition? Are you a witch?…
And then there is, “The lady doth protest too much, methinks” from Hamlet.
Author, once again you contribute to my amazing store of trivia. I’d never heard of the Kafka trap, though I seem to recall it being used on me. Denial of the existence of god implies recognition of the concept of god, thus a belief that god exists. Philosophy 101 bollocks of course. Thanks again.
As was quoted “man went on to prove that god didn’t exist, ‘oh ghat was easy said man’, he went on to prove that black was white and then sadly got run over on the next zebra crossing he encountered….
That’s a good point. Not as stated – of course recognition of the concept of a flat earth does not equal belief that the earth is flat.
But indeed, it’s hard to deny the existence of god without accepting some concept thereof, likely the culturally dominant one – and if you don’t believe in it, there was no really good reason to accept that concept. So there’s a circularity there, albeit in a sort of negative way.
That one was sheer genius! Thanks.
Brings to mind The Argument Clinic. I now want see it as John Cleese using the Kafka Trap to get a few extra pounds.
Aye. “Thats not an argument, thats just contradiction”…classic…
M27 Holts: Contradiction? No it’s not.
Hm…is this a five minute argument or the full half hour?
Mrs Kafka thought she’d seen the worst
That morning she and Mr Kafka burst
Through Franz’s door and saw the mattress dwarfed
By carapace, and her boy metamorphed –
The worst, at least, until her husband threw
The boy’s aquarium down, its contents too:
The sea invertebrates he’d been collecting.
“Why …” But Mr Kafka, interjecting,
Growled for every husband’s lost hegemonies:
“Verdammt! With Franz like this, who needs anemones?”
Brilliant, oh versed one!
Postdog: Good that. 🙂
“Well he would, wouldn’t he?” – Mandy Rice-Davies, when Lord Astor denied an affair or even having met her, during the “Profumo Affair” trial.
Known for: Profumo affair
Well once My wife and I bumped into a past girlfriend of mine (before I met my wife). Afterwards she asked me if I’d slept with her. I truthfully said “no”. Interrogation over and wife happy. If only she had asked the question in a way tbat most men would have…
Postdog, for humorous verse, that’s first rate stuff.
Laripu – you are too astute. It was not my work. I would attribute. But that is not advisable here
It would be plagiarism without my denial. No Kafka trap. No need for a trial.
For what shall it profit a man, if he gains admiration, but loses his own avatar.
But that last quote _was_ your own, right?
No. Just a transmogrification of yet another anonymous source.
Ah. Would that happen to be found in the anthology our cartoon heroes keep in their nightstand? It did sound familiar, somehow.
If you wonder, like me, how alas
Christians could give Trump a pass,
The best verse you’re liable
To find in the bible:
The dreaded jaw bone of an ass.
Trump seems to have disappeared off the map. Has he gone back to his reptilian lair in the hidden lands of the tsetse fly in equatorial africa to plot world domination with the rest of his fifth-column zionist shape changing reptilian brethren?
M27Holts: Re Trump: If only! In fact he still has a lot of residual support from republican supporters, with an eye to the 2024 presidential election. And he is having money-related legal problems, not least here in my native Bonnie Scotland re his two loss-making golf courses, which are suspected of being connected with money-laundering. We can only hope for a suitable cardiac event, which is not too unlikely.
Maybe his golf courses are secret entrances to tunnels that lead to a subterranean base under Loch Ness where the lizard aliens are secretely breeding an army of machine augmented mosasaurs that can be released to attack the uk’s submarine force…the sightings are of prototype cyborgs on their way to sea trials from their subterranean monster pens deep beneath scotland…
SOG, can the heartless have a heart attack?
Breathes there the man, with soul so dead,
Who never to himself hath said,
This is my own, my native land!
Whose heart hath ne’er within him burn’d,
As home his footsteps he hath turn’d,
From wandering on a foreign strand!
If such there breathe, go, mark him well;
For him no Minstrel raptures swell;
High though his titles, proud his name,
Boundless his wealth as wish can claim;
Despite those titles, power, and pelf,
The wretch, concentred all in self,
Living, shall forfeit fair renown,
And, doubly dying, shall go down
To the vile dust, from whence he sprung,
Unwept, unhonour’d, and unsung.
Sir Walter Scott
Since there’s talk of Trump, and poetry, here’s a one I wrote in 2018:
Conman’s Sonnet
They still believe in the golden god,
who cheats at home,
who cheats abroad,
who will not call the righteous friends,
and flatters vicious enemies,
and pursues only greedy ends,
and will betray the very ones
that offer troth.
When the edifice of falseness falls,
who will the godling blame
to save his skin, to clear his name?
Here’s another query:
Is he malicious? or merely mercenary?
Both, I think. I think it’s both.
“Trump” said God.
USA did…
….and it stunk…
“Fact is stranger than fiction.” – Mark Twain
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4oXZXT3D0UE